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| Mn Usa Freco Kids State 2018; Back to Rochester | |
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| Tweet Topic Started: Aug 21 2017, 08:15 PM (22,882 Views) | |
| CropDuster | Apr 6 2018, 01:44 PM Post #181 |
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"It also seems like the local freestyle events list has shrunken significantly over the past few years. With out the ample opportunity to try freestyle it is difficult to get new families really involved in the post season schedule" Yes, because a style that is only wrestled in our country is sadly what drives the sport's economy around here. Start in October, finish in April, and if you can get a freestyle tournament or two in, it's a success. Sad, really. |
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| Northwest | Apr 8 2018, 08:46 AM Post #182 |
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Transparency, I like that idea a lot. Perhaps information could be released so the membership understood just how much more profitable Rochester is vs. Monticello. Is it $5,000, $10,000, $20,000, or perhaps even more. I doubt you will ever see that information sent out to the membership. In fact, I doubt most of the mn/usa board members know the actual numbers themselves. This information is shared with only a select few. Not saying there are evil, in fact, they are hard working and doing what they feel is best. Rochester's money and location to their convenience has skewed their view as to what is best for the statewide organizations growth. Numbers up in Monti., what more can you ask for since overall participation in freestyle/greco has been declining? |
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| J Latterell | Apr 11 2018, 04:51 PM Post #183 |
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Something to consider for those who are considering boycotting the state kids freestyle/greco tournament. A All of the mat officials, pairers, table workers, security, media, and set up crews all show up for the entire weekend are volunteers. I understand your frustration over location and I happen to agree that a more central location is best for everyone who needs to travel. That being said to not show up over it in protest only hurts your own kids. I would encourage those who would skip the event to take your kids because they will be better for the experience. Form a committee and research what some other locations might offer. Fundraise to help offset any difference in costs. Join the MNUSA board and have your voices heard. Wrestlers don't quit when faced with challenges, they work past them. Have a great day |
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| gopherfan149 | Apr 11 2018, 07:53 PM Post #184 |
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Fantastic
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Sometimes you have to make a sacrifice to pave the way for the future wrestlers. Boycotting the state tournament 1 year is insignificant for development of a wrestler. But if is significant in letting them know we are unhappy with the location of enough do not go. For those who choose to go, I am fine with that and won’t try sway their choice. Just those that want change I think it’s something to consider. |
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| fatback | Apr 12 2018, 07:51 AM Post #185 |
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It really is not insignificant to a wrestlers development when you consider this tournament is the route necessary to go through in order to make the national duals team. There for we will be going. Just not thrilled with the location. |
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| kgeiser | Apr 12 2018, 08:02 AM Post #186 |
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Nice post. However, I think some people forget the time commitment, which is a much larger problem than the money part of this location. One can always raise money, one cannot add more hours in a day. |
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| J Latterell | Apr 12 2018, 10:12 AM Post #187 |
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I am sympathetic to those who must travel great distances. I myself will be going to volunteer my time now that my kid has aged out of this tournament. I will be skipping fishing opener and mother's day again but for the first time I will be doing it so some stranger who I do not know can get his and her kid on national teams or just to have a good tie and get better. It saddens me somewhat when people quit in protest over location when there are a room full of people making the same sacrifice that I am. Just some things to think about. |
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| Northwest | Apr 12 2018, 10:25 AM Post #188 |
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Some of these things you mention have already been done. A committee was formed, sites were visited, financial considerations were looked at and the choice was Monticello for greco/freestyle. You have to want it to work for it to work. As mentioned before, the St.Cloud convention and visitors office was offering close to what Rochester was offering for the Herb Brooks National Hockey facility. Monticello was not able to offer any substantial perks. Do some research folks, contact those in St. Cloud and see their level of interest. Dana Randt would be more than happy to visit with you |
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| Tiny Tornado | Apr 12 2018, 02:41 PM Post #189 |
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Tiny Tornado
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if you go to the Mn/Usa website, visit the Calendar page for May- click on KIDS/CADETS GRECO/FREESTYLE STATE, and it will show a page stating CLICKON LOCATION -- click on the word ROCHESTER, and you will get the link showing all the info....remember when choosing a hotel, that the event is at the CIVIC CENTER downtown this year....the hotel link is at the bottom of the EVENTS page.... Edited by Tiny Tornado, Apr 12 2018, 02:44 PM.
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| larson311 | Apr 12 2018, 03:08 PM Post #190 |
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Fantastic
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Thanks Tornado, here's the direct link to make it easier for everyone. https://www.mnusawrestling.org/page/show/1038744-2018-kids-cadets-and-girls-state-greco-and-freestyle |
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| kgeiser | Apr 13 2018, 08:36 AM Post #191 |
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Also curious how many mats they will be running and who will be in which gym? |
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| Iowan@heart | Apr 14 2018, 07:10 AM Post #192 |
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Fantastic
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The Rochester Amateur Sports Commission (actually just called "Rochester Sports" now) hasn't paid any money to MN/USA. They have committed time and volunteers and worked with local hotels to provide competitive rates. I have to believe that there is some city around the metro area that would like to host one or more of these events. All the city's CVB or a booster club needs to do is work with the MN/USA wrestling board to put together a proposal to host an event. Also, as it's been suggested before, get on the MN/USA board and try to sell the argument that MN/USA should move events around the state for the good of the sport. |
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| Northwest | Apr 14 2018, 08:53 AM Post #193 |
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Sorry Iowan. Included in packages offered are upfront money and comp. hotel rooms. Something Monticello could not match, therefore, back to Rochester the event went. I do get that is how business works but, this is a non-profit organization there to support the membership. Provide affordable events to the membership to grow the sport and the mission of USAW. The amount of money paid by the membership to attend events in the extreme SE corner of the state does not make any sense. Simple procedure, poll the membership and ask for their input. |
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| Iowan@heart | Apr 14 2018, 10:12 AM Post #194 |
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Fantastic
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The sports commission doesn't have money to hand out to events. If an organizing committee wants to make a commitment to book a certain number of rooms, they can request an advance on that revenue from the hotels. In all the years that I've been involved with wrestling events in Rochester, I've only seen one event ask for money up front, and it wasn't one of the events being discussed. I don't think anyone would argue with you that the ideal solution is to either move events around or have them more centrally located. If some city/facility/committee could put together a cost-effective proposal, I'm sure it would be fairly considered. Edited by Iowan@heart, Apr 14 2018, 10:13 AM.
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| Northwest | Apr 14 2018, 05:03 PM Post #195 |
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If there is no up front money or comp. rooms included, it should be pretty simple then. Facility charge vs. facility charge. What is a cost effective proposal if there are not motel rooms and upfront money? Perhaps it is not upfront money but, there are at the very least, rooms offered for so many rented for an event. Monticello could not offer such a perk but, St. Cloud could, would, and did. These events are in Rochester for one reason and it is not secret, money. The membership pays a lot of money to travel to the far corner of the state so mn/use can a few more bucks. |
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| stepitup | Apr 14 2018, 09:15 PM Post #196 |
Wrestling Fan
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I am late to this argument. And i would like not to readctheough seven pages of content. However i have a few questions about this. 1. What do you mean, “who is in which gym”. I understood the freestyle and greco state would be held at the mayo civic center. 2. Why are the bids and profits not common knowledge pieces to the membership? I would think the profits of the tournaments would be in the board minutes ? Or not? |
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| Iowan@heart | Apr 15 2018, 07:06 AM Post #197 |
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Fantastic
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You have the "cities" and "hotels" confused. Hotels can and do offer free rooms in exchange for commitments to steer business their direction. That's true for practically every sporting event in the country that identifies "host hotels". Typically they agree to provide 1 free room for every 30-40 rooms that fans book. The events also typically require that the rooms included in the block are available to fans at a below market rate. Events can alternatively (or also) ask hotels to provide a rebate on rooms booked by fans ($3-$10). For example, the rack rate of a room (price paid by anyone walking in off the street) might be $129/night. The event promises to promote the hotel in exchange for $79/night rooms for fans plus a $3 rebate. Cities and CVBs, sports commissions, etc just facilitate these discussions between hotels and events. They don't have slush funds of their own to throw around to bring events to a city. At least in Rochester, any rebates have to be used to offset the cost of the facility. They technically can't go into anyone's pocket. I'd be glad to work with someone who wants to put together a proposal for Monticello to host. We could post all the bids and meeting notes online so the whole MN/USA community could follow along. Edited by Iowan@heart, Apr 15 2018, 07:07 AM.
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| kgeiser | Apr 16 2018, 08:38 AM Post #198 |
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I think everyone needs to stop worrying about money and focus on time and fairness. I have lobbied against Rochester for years, and could care less how much money it costs. Families and our kids can't make more time- what that means is some wrestlers can't go when it's in Rochester. Plain and simple. And that's not fair. Now I realize life is not fair we all need to toughen up as a society, but when you have a statewide organization that constantly puts their state tournaments in the far SE part of the state- I have a major problem. We have kids who cannot go this year and have not gone in the past because of the time commitment who could go if it was remotely centralized. That to me should remove Rochester from the list of possibilities. I love MN USA wrestling, I am only asking they do right by our kids and the sport. |
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| CropDuster | Apr 16 2018, 10:20 AM Post #199 |
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I have probably 10+ guys that aren't choosing to do Junior State because it falls on prom weekend for them. It's a choice they make. Everyone has choices. Make yours, but it's not objectively right or wrong because it does or doesn't suit your personal interests. |
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| kgeiser | Apr 16 2018, 12:20 PM Post #200 |
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If you are referring to my post, then I take offense. It makes zero sense to have the tournament that far from central. The choices being made are from adults, not kids. One of my wrestlers missed because he had confirmation- you are right, he could've skipped it. OR, ADULTS could have made the tournament more central so kids aren't faced with such tough choices. No metro or southern MN kids are ever faced with such tough choices. There are some VERY OBJECTIVE reasons Rochester is wrong, not just to "suit my personal interests." Pull out a map and try prove me wrong. I have lots of objective facts for you if you'd like: 1. Monticello increased participation 2. Rochester is closer to Chicago than its northern Clubs 3. This is a state tournament and should at least be population central Edited by kgeiser, Apr 16 2018, 12:23 PM.
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| mndak | Apr 16 2018, 12:40 PM Post #201 |
Fantastic
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From the list of Minnesota USA wrestling clubs: https://www.teamusa.org/USA-Wrestling/Clubs/Find-a-Club Its roughly a 7 hour drive from the extreme north west club to the "State tournament" in Rochester. It is roughly a 30 minute drive from the farthest south eastern clubs. So for one kid it is a 3/4 day family commitment and for another it is a half to full day commitment. That kid up north has to have a parent take off a full day of work, drive all day, stay overnight in a hotel, wrestle the next day or two, stay overnight again and than spend all of the next day driving home. I don't think it is fair to compare a kid choosing prom vs a kid who's family isn't able to commit to a 3/4 day family trip. The priority of mnusa wrestling should be to provide an event that is equally accessible and affordable for the entire state. Currently the kids on the geographic edges are not being provided the same affordable access to these tournaments as others in the state. Edited by mndak, Apr 16 2018, 12:54 PM.
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| Iowan@heart | Apr 16 2018, 01:00 PM Post #202 |
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Fantastic
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Rochester is 60 minutes south of the cities. You can't blame all 7 hours of driving from the border of Canada on the Rochester location. Btw, the geographical center of the state is near Brainerd. |
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| mndak | Apr 16 2018, 01:18 PM Post #203 |
Fantastic
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Rochester is no where near the geographical center of mnusa wrestling clubs. The fact that you ignore that is troubling. If you continue to hold all major wrestling events in Rochester, you will be missing out on alot of talented young individuals from other areas of the state. No one is saying dont hold any events in Rochester, all they are saying is dont hold ALL of your events in Rochester. It would be beneficial for the sport and everyone involved to have one of the major Minnesota events in a more centralized location. For example: 2019 Folkstyle held in Rochester and Freestyle held in St.Cloud 2020 Folkstyle held in St. Cloud and Freestyle held in Rochester 2021 Folkstyle held in Rochester and Freestyle held in St. Cloud It still is located close to the metro area but allows for a greater geographical representation of wrestling in our state. on a side note Rochester is a great site for Northern Plains Edited by mndak, Apr 16 2018, 01:22 PM.
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| Northwest | Apr 16 2018, 07:02 PM Post #204 |
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The Civic Center auditorium can only handle 8 mats so, the adjacent gym is used for the other four mats which is something that was previously stated they would never do. The bids and profits are not common knowledge and only a select few know the bids and profits for each tournament. They are not in the minutes of board meetings nor can you find them in the year-end financial report as they are lumped in with other items. |
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| Iowan@heart | Apr 17 2018, 06:56 AM Post #205 |
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Fantastic
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Wow, you missed my point completely. I have always argued in favor of more locations for wrestling events. My post was intended to clarify the geography of the state. Someone said earlier that Rochester was a 7 hour drive and the cities was much closer. My point is that anyone that is 7 hours from Rochester is 6 hours from the cities. For those arguing in favor of a more central location, I suggested Brainerd which is near the geographical center of the state. Also, you used the "you" in your post. I don't have anything to do with the location of any wrestling events. |
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| sitoutking | Apr 17 2018, 07:13 AM Post #206 |
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Who said anything about geographic center of the state? I saw a post about population center. Monticello or Anoka or St.Micheal or Minneapolis would be fine. The inability of MNUSA to figure out this has been excrutiatingly frustrating. The Rochester "apologists" who refuse to at least see reason blow me away. Minneapolis to Rochester- 86.6 miles Anoka to Rochester-103 Monticello-124 This saves up to 2 hours, which is 4 hours round trip for ANYONE Monticello and north. |
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| bison | Apr 17 2018, 08:06 AM Post #207 |
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Lets look at this a little different. Some people are arguing they want this more centrally located. The most central location with a facility big enough is probably St. Cloud. Their argument is that the State Tournament is in the far South Eastern part of the state, yet if you divide the state into quarters, the cities is in the South Eastern part of the state. Thats where the largest numbers of kids are coming from. I'm sorry, to me it makes the most sense to have it where the most kids are coming from. Its unfortunate that some have to travel a greater distance then others, but this probably happens in most every state. Its also unfortunate that its cost you more time and money to do these things, that being said, get over it, life isn't fair. Some people are going to benefit more then others depending on where they live and what they do for a living. By protesting and skipping events your only hurting the development of your son or daughter. I guess if I had to decide which events i was going to take my kids to, i would skip NYWA and go to as many MNUSA events as possible. I think NYWA does a great job and we have always enjoyed the tournament. That being said there are a lot more opportunities in USA wrestling. Heartland Dual teams (Grade school and Middle School) Novice Goodwill Dual team Schoolboy Dual teams Cadet Dual teams Junior Dual Teams Kids Nationals Fargo Nationals Train at the Olympic Training Center Plus chances to travel outside of the USA (World Teams, Pan America Teams.) I'm sure ill get blasted for my comments for being to insensitive to the people from the Northern part of the state, but i'm a big boy and i can take it. |
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| sitoutking | Apr 17 2018, 08:43 AM Post #208 |
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You just don't get it. That dead horse we are kicking is even getting tired. When the tournament moved to Monticello, numbers increased. That was good. And guess what? A whole boatload of people saved time and money. And let me say this again: NUMBERS INCREASED PEOPLE ACROSS THE STATE SAVED MONEY PEOPLE ACROSS THE STATE SAVED TIME Everyone wins!!! |
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| mndak | Apr 17 2018, 08:44 AM Post #209 |
Fantastic
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The participants are coming from the south east because the tournament is located in their backyard. The farthest south eastern club is only 30 some miles from Rochester. The diehard families will always make the trip, but the focus should be on increasing participation across the state. This can only be done by having affordable locations that will draw new families to the event. |
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| Northwest | Apr 17 2018, 09:10 AM Post #210 |
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Cities vs. Hotels, host hotels, rebates, rack rates, CVB's, sports commissions, slush funds. This is not the Olympic trials, the Final Four, the Super Bowl, the NCAA D1 tournament. This is a youth tournament which should be reasonably located so as to increase participation which Monticello did. A two year test and the brain trust says, "it did not increase as much as we thought it would". So, with all this information that has been thrown out, a simple solution would be for someone from mn/usa to compare the last year the freestyle/greco event was in Rochester to the 2 years it was in Monticello. Compare the profits and let the membership see how much money you are talking about. It would pale in comparison to the added cost and time for the participants. |
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