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Forest Lake Freakfest; Greco/Freestyle
Topic Started: Apr 24 2008, 10:44 PM (1,918 Views)
Unit
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Fantastic
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Should be a fun weekend of "SUMMER FUN" style of wrestling.

We will be doing the double header with a van load of first timers. Does anyone remember when it got over last year on Saturday??? I have been MIA from the wife 4 several weekend wrestling........thought I could give her a heads up when I may be pulling into Unitville :D :blink: :D

Should be a barn burner as it is the only gig around.

Any one else doing the stay over???? Country Inn.......poolside.
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XHockeyDad
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MAT BANDITS will be there. This should be a great tournament....forest lake always does a great job....

...be prepared for a long day....just the nature of the beast.
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Unit
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outstanding Greco numbers lastnight. 215 plus and around the 4 hours mark to clear the gym.
Seen some very sound Greco wrestlers and some some new ones catching onto the art as well.

Great night to be a greco Head!


Today should be a freakfest.......little snow outside with some major heat inside.
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Big D
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Pretty good gig..moved well today during FS (whilst we were there anyway)
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Unit
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close to 500 wrestler today........as I was leaving they had mats getting rolled up.
Long weekend but a well fought one!!!

Packed to the rafters!
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guide07
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Nice turn out Saturday but I wish more could be done to get the 2 man bracket kids a second or third match by communicating with them and setting up, at least, exhibition matches. We had one exhibition match on the Junior mat and I know there could have been some that should have been set up for cadets. I brought a small cadet to the tourney and he had one match. Even to cross over to another age group would be totally acceptable to most of these kids as these programs are mainly about mat time and the love of the sport. These kids would not pour their hearts into this sport if they didn't want to compete. Just one man's opinion. <_<
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flounder
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My son is a very fit 190 lb. schoolboy and he has yet to get a greco match at 4 tourneys, and only one freestyle match at each tourney. I agree that they should set up some exhibition matches or maybe allow moving up in age class. Wish some more of the big kids would spring and summer wrestle, it would make heavyweight matches more entertaining in the future.
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wonderfromdownunder
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They dont' allow schoolboys to move up a division and they don't allow them to wrestle kids that are to diffrent in weight. See both sides of it. but why can cadets move up to wrestle in the Junior division?? Seems like it would be the same thing to me. You should be able to move up one age group if you chose to do so.
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Tiny Tornado
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Cadets are allowed to move up to Jr's ONLY if they are also high school age; meaning grades 9-12 - I think it's due to the fact that if you're a HS wrestler, a freshman or a sophomore could wrestle a senior
but as an example: Eric Devos is a very accomplished high school wrestler, correct ? He's probably already wrestled kids a few grades above him many many times ? yet he could not wrestle at Junior State, because he's an 8th grader.

At USA Wrestling sanctioned tournaments we aren't allowed to change the rules....

Glad to hear you had a nice turnout, Forest Lake ! ;)
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heavyweightdad
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It is frustrating the rules MNUSA has in terms of not being allowed to move weight/age UP...and as a result some very big/very small kids don't get enough matches. It is the rules and I understand. But there should be a better system for ex matches set up in general....???? It is tough to drive 1-2 hours to a tourney to get no matches or 1 match...
However, I think they have gotten much better, going away from the 5 lb rule to the percentage rule, which is a little better, (more liberal weight wise) and has gotten more matches for kids from what I have observed. Definately an improvement.

I have seen kids give up 20-30 lbs, and 5 grades during HS season, no issues,
but can't wrestle up 8-10 lbs in FS season...
and I think that 9th grade cadet rule is there because 99% of states do not allow 7-8ths on V/JV, or else why would it matter if you were an 8th grade cadet?
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guide07
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My original intent was not to change any rules, but only to make the individual tournament directors become a little more active in finding these kids more matches, exhibition or other means. At our folkstyle elementary tourney we always tried to identify these kids at weighin and ask at that time if they would be willing to move up or down to get more matches. Rarely were we turned down.
I think the parents of these small or big kids could also help out with this as they know it has happened before and frustrate them as well. It is not fun to pay full entry and only get one match for it.
7
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crdirector
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As it was stated earlier you cannot deviate from MN/USA rules on a sanctioned event. USA wrestling holds the insurance for the facility in many cases. If the rules are not followed and something bad happens the school is liable. No good.
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Tiny Tornado
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crdirector is correct ; you cannot do it even if you wanted to-

most elementary folkstyle tournaments are not sanctioned by USA`Wrestling, at least not anymore - so exhibition matches between kids of different age groups , etc can be allowed....
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HDPOLFOOTBASEWREST
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guide07
Apr 28 2008, 11:29 AM
My original intent was not to change any rules, but only to make the individual tournament directors become a little more active in finding these kids more matches, exhibition or other means. At our folkstyle elementary tourney we always tried to identify these kids at weighin and ask at that time if they would be willing to move up or down to get more matches. Rarely were we turned down.
I think the parents of these small or big kids could also help out with this as they know it has happened before and frustrate them as well. It is not fun to pay full entry and only get one match for it.
7

we have gone to 3 tournaments have gotten 5 match's paid 48 dollars
that is $9.60 a match seems like a bit pricey to me not to mention the gas
thank god my son loves wrestling just wish we could get some more matches
why not put smaller kids with more experience with bigger kids with less experience my son gets his butt kicked twice a week by a kid who weighs 20 lbs less than him? poeple wonder why there is no heavy weights or light weights on high school teams i think they feel alienated cause they don t get any matches when they are young never get to wrestle at tournaments wait for 4 or 5 hours and get one or two matches . Nothing ever gets done about it just people telling you why it is that way and there is nothing that can be done about it! typically
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KJO
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I think the issue with USA Wrestling not allowing kids wrestle different weight and or age groups is due to liability issues. USA Wrestling group has insurance to cover wrestlers injured in competition. I would assume that the insurance company does not want to increase their liability and risk from an underwriting perspective.
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hockeymom
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KJO
Apr 28 2008, 03:39 PM
I think the issue with USA Wrestling not allowing kids wrestle different weight and or age groups is due to liability issues. USA Wrestling group has insurance to cover wrestlers injured in competition. I would assume that the insurance company does not want to increase their liability and risk from an underwriting perspective.

I am sure you are correct. I also know they have to follow the rules... and I understand why people are frustrated and want more matches, so what is the solution?
maybe some other ways to conduct a tourney would be a good idea in the future? How about a 1/2 day clinic followed by scrimmages? No awards, anyone can wrestle anyone type deal. High Flyers did this 3 times one summer and it was a lot of fun... certainly more live wrestling and mat time for everyone.
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Tiny Tornado
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HDP;
ok if I call you that for short ? I'm sorry to say, but that's the way it is, and NO, nothing can be done to change it, unless they change the rules at the National level- all state organizations belong under the USA`Wrestling umbrella, and they have annual meetings and discuss changes, etc - so whatever they decide is the rules that all USA`Wrestling Clubs must adhere to-
one example is the decision to change/eliminate two of the weight groups for Schoolboys - not everybody agrees with that decision, some are OK with it, but we all have to live with it-
I do understand your frustration, and all I can offer to say is, HANG IN THERE-
my son was always the smallest for whatever age group - A, or AA - one match per tournament, sometimes 2, sometimes none- he grew older, and the older he got, the more matches he got- eventually he did quite well in spite of the lesser amt of mat time- in fact right now he's doing quite well; considering his slow beginnings...
so anyway, sorry to say but Greco/Freestyle is governed by an organization that makes rules for the safety of all their participants, and maybe you could say the MAJORITY-so if you have a kid that's not in the majority, or the "normal" weight range for his age- you just have to decide either to be patient, or to find other ways to get him more mat time....but I hope you dont give up :)
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guide07
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As much as I see this as an over the top protection issue for the USA program, I still see that it could be compromised in some way to work for these kids. Why don't the tourneys at least let the 2 man group have a second match with eachother, which may lead to a third if the outcome is a split decision? Same weight yet, same age group.....Now what would be the insurance ruling?
As I said in my first post, I don't even have one of these kids as my own, but still see it as missed opportunities for these guys. How about some positive suggestions, instead of the tough luck insurance response again. <_<
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Tiny Tornado
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some tournaments used to let those guys who only had 2 in their group do the best 2 out of 3- the times this year that I've asked, I've been told that most of the parents complain if the tournament runs too long, so they are hesitant to take the time ? it will never be done at a state tournament, but sometimes the opens used to do it- just haven't seen it yet this year- maybe if we had a few more parent/volunteer ref's, it would be easier to get that done :rolleyes:

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HDPOLFOOTBASEWREST
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Tiny Tornado
Apr 29 2008, 11:25 AM
some tournaments used to let those guys who only had 2 in their group do the best 2 out of 3- the times this year that I've asked, I've been told that most of the parents complain if the tournament runs too long, so they are hesitant to take the time ? it will never be done at a state tournament, but sometimes the opens used to do it- just haven't seen it yet this year- maybe if we had a few more parent/volunteer ref's, it would be easier to get that done :rolleyes:

I worked a table at forest lake
They would bring us Brackets but no kids that happened several times
i had to send my son up to the head table 30 times at least he was occupied seeing as he only got 2 matches won one lost one .

problem one is the annoucing and no one hearing it so now your waiting for one kid or the kid is there and his coach aint or the coach is there but the parents arent so wait it doesnt have anything to do with the amount of matches it is the KAOS of the people running it!

i still say that gopher state has the best idea they have no# matches
it is easy you willm wrestle match 35 be there 3 mathches in advance so simple
USA needs to re structure there style in order to acheive a better Product
believe me i was at almost every tournament this year folk style and freestyle

i did enjoy the table working and will do that when ever given a chance great seat
seen alot of great matches seen alot 20 second matches !

we had 4 brackets giver to us once and there was not one kid at our mat they didnt annonce it wow what can you do!
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HDPOLFOOTBASEWREST
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also they didnt bring any food i was there at that table for 5 hours got 2 small gatorades

i thought the ref was going to die from dehidration

someone brought the ref a hot dog about 2pm

oh sorry they did put some m&m's with pretzels on our table which the kids ate
i aint complaining just stating facts

i was eastveiw and they were bringing food out to the tables all day oh well

i did have a good time !
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KJO
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guide07
Apr 28 2008, 10:16 PM
As much as I see this as an over the top protection issue for the USA program, I still see that it could be compromised in some way to work for these kids. Why don't the tourneys at least let the 2 man group have a second match with eachother, which may lead to a third if the outcome is a split decision? Same weight yet, same age group.....Now what would be the insurance ruling?
As I said in my first post, I don't even have one of these kids as my own, but still see it as missed opportunities for these guys. How about some positive suggestions, instead of the tough luck insurance response again. <_<

Here is my idea!!!!!

Write a letter USA Wrestling to recommend making changes on this issue. At least you could say then that you had a chance to voice your opinion to a group of people that can make change happen.

http://www.themat.com/contact.php

USA Wrestling Board & Staff

National Office Board & Committees
President: Jim Ravannack
1st Vice President: Greg Strobel
2nd Vice President: Van Stokes
Treasurer: Duane Morgan
Secretary: Larry Sciacchetano



6155 Lehman Drive
Colorado Springs, CO 80918
Phone: (719) 598-8181
Fax: (719) 598-9440
http://www.themat.com


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guide07
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Letter was sent to them today. ;)
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