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Recruits!
Topic Started: Dec 31 2014, 07:48 PM (944,625 Views)
EastonRedRover
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I saw that Kasper McIntosh listed the Gophers as his college of choice. He is currently ranked 13th at 145.

How good is this kid?
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JAW2517
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KnightFever
Nov 10 2017, 04:34 AM
DWB79
Nov 9 2017, 12:54 AM
grappler6
Nov 9 2017, 12:28 AM
DWB79
Nov 9 2017, 12:15 AM
Name one team of the following that has had worse luck getting top 10 OUT of state recruits to come to their team and have had problems (like Stroker, Mason, Disney, Geiger, Cooperman---don[t know how many of those were top 25, but most were probably top 50 nationally)...

Ohio St.
Penn St.
Iowa
Cornell
Ok. St.

I don't remember any of those teams having as many big issues as the Gophers have had over the last 15 years or so...

And most of those teams have been much more successful with recruiting.
Not going to break it down, but each school listed has missed on top 10 recruits they were after. Each school has had problems with top recruits over that timespan. Gophers could be at a slightly higher rate, but without a full set of data hard to say. You follow MN wrestling closer than those programs so our problems seem polarizing, but the reality is they are much the same as a lot of other schools.

Recency bias is getting u if you fail to see the program's success over the last 15 years.
My point is, we don't get near as many top 25 guys---Gable/McKee this year is awesome. Storley was good even if we thought he should have won a title or two in his career and he sometimes got too conservative.

The last big group of success that you could say we had with "top 25 or so talent" was the Reiter/ CP Schlatter/Kish group and that's been what class? 2003, graduating in 2008? The Mason/Geiger/Disney class was a mess that came in around 08/09 or so ....Other than Storley, how many other guys were top 25 recruits? Nelson/Schiller/Ness and Dardanes were not top 25 guys from what I remember, some over-performed and some under-performed....

Grap--I know you are homer and that's fine. I want the Gophers to succeed, I want them to end Pedophile State Univ (PSU) and Ohio St. and those teams streak of titles, but I think it is time to take the head out of the sand. We NEED more out of state top 25 talent that are can't miss to mesh with the McKee's, Gable, etc. and improve so we can beat the best. Lee would be a great start...We'll need more.
Allar 23
Mitch McKee 13
Tommy Thorn 16
Ethan Lizak 13

I could look up more
What ranking site had Lizak at 13? He was in the 70s on Intermat.
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pitbull413
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EastonRedRover
Nov 10 2017, 08:35 AM
I saw that Kasper McIntosh listed the Gophers as his college of choice. He is currently ranked 13th at 145.

How good is this kid?
He is already committed to the Gophers and he's a good pick up, ranked #8? By Flo also I think. And just took 5th at Super32 (Eischens took 8th same bracket)
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Taz
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Caden steffen is gopher tough!
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EastonRedRover
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Taz
Nov 10 2017, 10:01 AM
Caden steffen is gopher tough!
Caden is overlooked nationally. He should be ranked top 25 in the nation for his weight.

Congrats to Caden and the Gophers.
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MN_Gazonni
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Riley Habish committed to NDSU
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Elwood
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I love the Caden Steffen commitment. He's a 'diamond in the rough' type wrestler with great upside.
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KnightFever
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JAW2517
Nov 10 2017, 08:45 AM
KnightFever
Nov 10 2017, 04:34 AM
DWB79
Nov 9 2017, 12:54 AM
grappler6
Nov 9 2017, 12:28 AM

Quoting limited to 4 levels deep
My point is, we don't get near as many top 25 guys---Gable/McKee this year is awesome. Storley was good even if we thought he should have won a title or two in his career and he sometimes got too conservative.

The last big group of success that you could say we had with "top 25 or so talent" was the Reiter/ CP Schlatter/Kish group and that's been what class? 2003, graduating in 2008? The Mason/Geiger/Disney class was a mess that came in around 08/09 or so ....Other than Storley, how many other guys were top 25 recruits? Nelson/Schiller/Ness and Dardanes were not top 25 guys from what I remember, some over-performed and some under-performed....

Grap--I know you are homer and that's fine. I want the Gophers to succeed, I want them to end Pedophile State Univ (PSU) and Ohio St. and those teams streak of titles, but I think it is time to take the head out of the sand. We NEED more out of state top 25 talent that are can't miss to mesh with the McKee's, Gable, etc. and improve so we can beat the best. Lee would be a great start...We'll need more.
Allar 23
Mitch McKee 13
Tommy Thorn 16
Ethan Lizak 13

I could look up more
What ranking site had Lizak at 13? He was in the 70s on Intermat.
Flo
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DMC
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EastonRedRover
Nov 10 2017, 10:49 AM
Taz
Nov 10 2017, 10:01 AM
Caden steffen is gopher tough!
Caden is overlooked nationally. He should be ranked top 25 in the nation for his weight.

Congrats to Caden and the Gophers.
He could potentially be another Brett Pratt IMO. Great pick up.
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JAW2517
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KnightFever
Nov 10 2017, 11:39 AM
JAW2517
Nov 10 2017, 08:45 AM
KnightFever
Nov 10 2017, 04:34 AM
DWB79
Nov 9 2017, 12:54 AM

Quoting limited to 4 levels deep
Allar 23
Mitch McKee 13
Tommy Thorn 16
Ethan Lizak 13

I could look up more
What ranking site had Lizak at 13? He was in the 70s on Intermat.
Flo
Flo had him 13 overall? Wow that is quite a difference between sites.
Edited by JAW2517, Nov 10 2017, 12:19 PM.
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pitbull413
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DMC
Nov 10 2017, 12:13 PM
EastonRedRover
Nov 10 2017, 10:49 AM
Taz
Nov 10 2017, 10:01 AM
Caden steffen is gopher tough!
Caden is overlooked nationally. He should be ranked top 25 in the nation for his weight.

Congrats to Caden and the Gophers.
He could potentially be another Brett Pratt IMO. Great pick up.
I disagree. Just watched a video of him vs Trey Rogers of Hastings and he got completely owned. Showed absolutely no offense in this match. Looking at other results it looks like he's lost to many MN kids his own age the last couple years in season and out of season, that's just MN kids. A diamond in the rough is a rarity and I feel like everyone wants to classify any good small town kid out of southern Minnesota a diamond in the rough, in fact people were just saying the same thing about Bailee O'Reilly lol
Glad to have both wrestlers but people need to pump the breaks on the Pfarr comparisons.
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grappler6
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Pfarr lost to his share of MN kids as well. Had similar placing a at the tournaments Steffen has had some success at.

Probably a shade below Brett overall coming out of high school, but making the comparison is valid to this point in their careers.

Obviously Brett jumped levels in college. Time will tell if Steffen can do the same.

Either way a solid pickup.
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true future
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Didn't Pfarr have a junior freestyle AA to his name? Havnt seen a result like that from Steffen.
Edited by true future, Nov 10 2017, 01:27 PM.
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Go47
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Caden Steffen
2016-17
NHSCA National Wrestling Champion at 182 lbs
USAW Folkstyle Nationals all American at 182 lbs
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grappler6
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true future
Nov 10 2017, 01:00 PM
Didn't Pharr have a junior freestyle AA to his name? Havnt seen a result like that from Steffen.
Brett Pfarr- 5th (Junior 170/2012) 3rd (Cadet 145/2010) Fargo All American

Then he either won or placed high at sophomore, junior and senior division at NHSCA. Same tournament Steffen won this summer. Like I said similar placings at the tournaments Steffen has had success at.
Edited by grappler6, Nov 10 2017, 01:19 PM.
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grappler6
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I thought Pfarr was a pre season nationals AA too, but it was Northern Plains regional that he placed 2nd and 3rd after his senior high school season.

His only time competing at Pre Season Nationals he DNP as either a freshman or Soohomore.

Also had 3rd place Greco Fargo finish his senior year.
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true future
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Out of all the combined accomplishments listed in the last two posts the junior freestyle AA is easily the most signigficant imo.

NHSCA is not heavily attended by top guys anymore. Fargo also attracts a lot more top guys than folkstyle nationals in Iowa.

Steffen may end up being great in college, and I hope he does being a Gopher fan, but imo Pfarr had better credentials coming out of high school.
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pitbull413
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Go47
Nov 10 2017, 01:03 PM
Caden Steffen
2016-17
NHSCA National Wrestling Champion at 182 lbs
USAW Folkstyle Nationals all American at 182 lbs
Just looked at Steffens bracket from NHSCA Nationals and there was literally ZERO ranked wrestlers in his bracket via Flo rankings. Still a great accomplishment just pointing out the facts.
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notapedlaces
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Cadet GR runner-up in Fargo last year too.
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Dragon's Fire
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Great to hear about Caden! Congratulations! If you all could just take a breath and give a kid his day!

Congratulations! Again! You deserve it!

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true future
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notapedlaces
Nov 10 2017, 01:34 PM
Cadet GR runner-up in Fargo last year too.
Junior Freestyle >>>>>>Cadet Greco

Pfarr had wins over Dylan Reel and Geordan Speiller in the tournament where he was Junior AA, and Alex Meyer didn't even place.
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Go47
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true future
Nov 10 2017, 01:42 PM
notapedlaces
Nov 10 2017, 01:34 PM
Cadet GR runner-up in Fargo last year too.
Junior Freestyle >>>>>>Cadet Greco

Pfarr had wins over Dylan Reel and Geordan Speiller in the tournament where he was Junior AA, and Alex Meyer didn't even place.
You just killed your entire point. If Alex Meyer can have success without being an AA in Freestyle, why shouldn't someone think Caden has the potential to have equal success? Caden is still in high school and I believe has one more year to become a Freestyle AA. I'm a believer.
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grappler6
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true future
Nov 10 2017, 01:42 PM
notapedlaces
Nov 10 2017, 01:34 PM
Cadet GR runner-up in Fargo last year too.
Junior Freestyle >>>>>>Cadet Greco

Pfarr had wins over Dylan Reel and Geordan Speiller in the tournament where he was Junior AA, and Alex Meyer didn't even place.
Pfarr did that the summer after his senior season. Ya know something Caden hasn't gotten to yet.

Again just referring to at this point in their career. The comparison is Valid IMO to this point.

Ben Pherson who writes for the Post Bulleton in Rochester has this to say: The Gophers offering a kid like Caden Steffen gives me a lot of hope for the future of the program. He's the kind of raw, under-the-radar gem who will put in the work and could someday be an All-American. He's not afraid to get beat up to get better.

A great kid, glad he wants to be a Gopher!
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DWB79
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Glad he wants to be a Gopher and I hope he does well....

Grap--As for all the "Top 25" rankings you listed, not all were top 25 overall.

Maybe you can point me to Intermat's archives to prove this, but I remember the Dardanes were separated by quite few spots on the top 100 and neither was in the top 25 I believe. I don't think Nelson was in the top 25. Dylan Ness wasn't either from my memory. Top 25 overall is pretty select...Short was #1 or 2 at his weight class, I don't remember Wanzek being top 25...Short was. I believe Kroells was top 2-3 at his wgt so he probably was in that 20-25 range.

Stroker, Early, Ortiz I believe were all top 2-3 at their weight and all were busts either wrestling wise (Ortiz) or dedication wise (Stroker) plus crappy behavior (Early). How many were in the top 25 overall is still up in the air. If you can get the archived rankings of Intermat, then by all means post it. If Thorn wasn't "top 25", then most of these guys weren't either. I still think before the last year...Storley is one of the only a few that were top 25.
Edited by DWB79, Nov 10 2017, 02:18 PM.
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true future
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Go47
Nov 10 2017, 01:53 PM
true future
Nov 10 2017, 01:42 PM
notapedlaces
Nov 10 2017, 01:34 PM
Cadet GR runner-up in Fargo last year too.
Junior Freestyle >>>>>>Cadet Greco

Pfarr had wins over Dylan Reel and Geordan Speiller in the tournament where he was Junior AA, and Alex Meyer didn't even place.
You just killed your entire point. If Alex Meyer can have success without being an AA in Freestyle, why shouldn't someone think Caden has the potential to have equal success? Caden is still in high school and I believe has one more year to become a Freestyle AA. I'm a believer.
You need to read better my point is how big of recruits they were coming out of high school, not how they would do in college.

All my posts on the topic have been about why Pfarr was a bigger recruit coming out of high school. Nothing more nothing less.
Edited by true future, Nov 10 2017, 02:21 PM.
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true future
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grappler6
Nov 10 2017, 01:56 PM
true future
Nov 10 2017, 01:42 PM
notapedlaces
Nov 10 2017, 01:34 PM
Cadet GR runner-up in Fargo last year too.
Junior Freestyle >>>>>>Cadet Greco

Pfarr had wins over Dylan Reel and Geordan Speiller in the tournament where he was Junior AA, and Alex Meyer didn't even place.
Pfarr did that the summer after his senior season. Ya know something Caden hasn't gotten to yet.

Again just referring to at this point in their career. The comparison is Valid IMO to this point.

Ben Pherson who writes for the Post Bulleton in Rochester has this to say: The Gophers offering a kid like Caden Steffen gives me a lot of hope for the future of the program. He's the kind of raw, under-the-radar gem who will put in the work and could someday be an All-American. He's not afraid to get beat up to get better.

A great kid, glad he wants to be a Gopher!
If Steffen is a junior freestyle AA this year then I will agree that him and Pfarr are pretty much even recruits.
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MNRodent
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It would be nice, if when new recruits are announced, that we take a moment to congratulate them or list positive accomplishments, rather than trying to find reasons they won't succeed.
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grappler6
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DWB79
Nov 10 2017, 02:16 PM
Glad he wants to be a Gopher and I hope he does well....

Grap--As for all the "Top 25" rankings you listed, not all were top 25 overall.

Maybe you can point me to Intermat's archives to prove this, but I remember the Dardanes were separated by quite few spots on the top 100 and neither was in the top 25 I believe. I don't think Nelson was in the top 25. Dylan Ness wasn't either from my memory. Top 25 overall is pretty select...Short was #1 or 2 at his weight class, I don't remember Wanzek being top 25...Short was. I believe Kroells was top 2-3 at his wgt so he probably was in that 20-25 range.

Stroker, Early, Ortiz I believe were all top 2-3 at their weight and all were busts either wrestling wise (Ortiz) or dedication wise (Stroker) plus crappy behavior (Early). How many were in the top 25 overall is still up in the air. If you can get the archived rankings of Intermat, then by all means post it. If Thorn wasn't "top 25", then most of these guys weren't either. I still think before the last year...Storley is one of the only a few that were top 25.
Using Earl's D1CW top 100 list, which is typically pretty close to Flo and Intermat and just much easier to navigate for this discussion, yes all that I listed were top 25 recruits. I follow this all very closely and I recalled that list from mostly memory of all the various rankings and then went to Earl's site to verify a couple and catch any that I missed.
http://d1collegewrestling.net/Recruiting_Front.html

Earl now does High School Rankings for The Open Mat.


Feel free to search for Intermat's top 100, which most are behind a paywall, if you wish.

I think you are thinking top 10 overall recruits, which yes Storley has been one of the few.

My memory recalls Lizak's being 56ish on Flo top 100.
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grappler6
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Tony is the only I am a lil foggy on. I wanna say he was exactly 25, but can't find a list to verify. He was the #1 215 I know that for certain.
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grappler6
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grappler6
Nov 10 2017, 02:34 PM
Tony is the only I am a lil foggy on. I wanna say he was exactly 25, but can't find a list to verify. He was the #1 215 I know that for certain.
http://d1collegewrestling.net/Recruiting_2009.html

Tony was 49. I was wrong there.
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